It's My Draft, I'll Trade Up If I Want To!
by David_Wyatt on Feb 25, 2012 2:41 PM EST
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There were some excellent snippets of information in the Eric Allen interview with Mike Tannenbaum at the combine that Vill posted up earlier, and one of the last bits hinted at the possibility of trading up:
The Jets currently own choices in every round and should be in position to obtain one or more compensatory selections, but trading up is always an option for Tannenbaum.
"I do believe in quality over quantity," he said. "That’s just based on a lot of research and what’s a replaceable part and what the odds are of success in every round."
First of all I am happy to hear that Mike will be exploring under every stone and at the end of the day it is about quality, but any fool can tell you that the Jets depth needs addressing. Moving up in this draft for me, would be extremely disappointing. I know that everyone wants that pass rushing beast, the Ingram's or the Upshaws or even the Coples if he falls a little.
However there is enough in this draft to get both quality and quantity. If anything I hope Mike bucks his trend and moves down. I don't know about anyone else but I think round one and two and to an extent three and four have a ton of talent. We need several areas addressing and we don't have a ton of cap room to do it, we need to add depth. It's all well and good saying quality is what you need, but if I can take quality/quantity or a mixture of both. I'm taking the mixture.
I like Mike as a GM, I really do. However just like when you are playing the game of football, over pursuing can cause a lot of harm to your team, sometimes an aggressive nature manifests itself to impatient drafting. Trading up in this draft? It's simply not a logical move for this team right now.
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Mike T is a good all-around GM
But he’s much better at dealing with contracts and numbers and that part of the business. He’s a gambler and he over-pursues sometime, but his drafts have been pretty solid, so I have a lot of confidence in him. I agree with you though, we have so many holes and this is a deep draft, so this might not be the draft to trade up.
"We didn't lose the game; we just ran out of time."-Vince Lombardi
Staff Writer, GangGreenNation.com
we don't have the cap room to fix all our holes thru FA
the way mike T is talking makes me think the guy is clueless . research ? what is he talking about .
the only way any type of valid research could be used is from last year when the new rookie pay scale came into effect .
he still thinks vlad was a great pick . he needs to get his act together or he will be joining schotty next year .
Mike needs to stop the bullshit and get as many good players from this years draft as possible
follow me on TWITTER @tinley24
i want jeffery in green at pick 16
Notre Dame vs. Navy: The Emerald Isle Classic
Date:Sept. 1, 2012
Location:Dublin, Ireland
sounds like he is talking about research across the history of the league, round by round, performance measures, perhaps by position as well. etc.
At least I hope so.
It's Bogus Whatever It Is
He’s an effing moron.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
Sure we do...
well not completely, but we have decent space already (something like $8million) and thats with no one cut and only one restructuring.
founding member of PACOS (People Against the Constant Overuse of Sarcastic font)
GGN-Moderator
but this is what happens every year
we trade up or trade away our picks , sign guys to massive contracts they don’t deserve and then we battle like crazy to get under the cap .
change the record mike . yes we got revis by trading up and harris too but how many division titles or SB’s have we won ?
thats how you measure success .
and on that point apart from harris how many other 2nd round picks have been good for us ? tanny can’t seem to find a decent player in the 2nd round . another blank this year and i want the guy gone .
follow me on TWITTER @tinley24
i want jeffery in green at pick 16
Notre Dame vs. Navy: The Emerald Isle Classic
Date:Sept. 1, 2012
Location:Dublin, Ireland
I'm all for dynamic impact players.
If a guy slips for whatever reason, I’m all for pouncing on that shit. Patience is a virtue and all, but if the bases are juiced and you know you’re gonna get a fast ball and your’re sitting dead red on it, and you get it on the first pitch… unleash on that sumummabitch. If Bruce Irvin or Markelle Martin is somehow there at the top of the fourth, go get him Tanny.
Trading up in the 4th, I’m good with. Mainly not up for trading up in the first.
Eternal optimist
New York Jets
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Jets/Cubs/Norwich City FC/PSG
I'd do it in the third, if it was the right guy.
And the home of the .... JETS!!!
Now lets get a G-D snack!!!
"You might not like that. You might be very cynical about that. Well, f**k it, I don't care what you think."-Roy McDonald
I think the JETS are in a good position to Trade Down
IMO there are decent possabilities to trade down in the first, I would hope Tanny considers. I look at how the Patriots handle their draft, on paper they look brilliant, but they get nothing out of the draft. I’m on board on trading up in the 3rd or 4th round…. a star would have to fall big time to trade up to 37 (4th rd pick)
That’s so true; NE stockpiles all these draft picks every year, keeps trading back and still doesn’t have any impact players to show for it.
by nationalist88 on Feb 25, 2012 10:51 PM EST up reply actions
I'd prefer back in the 1st, up in the 2nd and 3rd.
founding member of PACOS (People Against the Constant Overuse of Sarcastic font)
GGN-Moderator
If anything I hope Mike bucks his trend and moves down.
I think that Mr. T. sees himself as the anti-Belichick (and interesting that Belichick’s draft choice shock piling last year didn’t really pan out as much as a lot of people thought it would). T wants to score big in the draft and Free Agency (for his PR) and then gym-rat himself a team, I suspect.
He has the feeling that a team is made up of several high priced stars at premium positions by scheme (but not something like “pass rusher” which is overpriced in his mind) and then the rest are “value” gets. I’m not sure he sees value in the later rounds so much though.
Just my guess.
I'm Glad You Like Him
There are many people that I can say I despise and wish something awful would happen to them, but Tanny is rapidly becoming one of those people. I think he’s a fool.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
That Should Read "Aren't" many people
LOL!
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
Yeah but when Tanny was teamed with Mangini their drafts were lights the fk out. He’s gotta have some kinda skills
by nationalist88 on Feb 25, 2012 10:53 PM EST up reply actions
play makers on defense
we need play makers on defense, aside from an elite player in Revis and a very good player in Harris, we are lacking playmakers.
by monaso on Feb 25, 2012 5:40 PM EST reply actions 2 recs
exactly
and the chances of getting a play maker by sitting pat and hoping they fall to your lap in the 4th 5th and 6th rounds are slim to none. It’s not illogical to consider burning a pick for some flexibility in order to get the players that you want.
Getting only 3 players is one thing, but a draft of 4 or 5 players is certainly acceptable. Even more so if you land a Suggs or a Demarco Murray type player.
+1
I know I'm human, and that's my greatest weakness. But, I never let it stop me, and that's my greatest strength. - Frank Castle
A Draft of 4 or 5 Players
when the Jets will have 10-11 draft picks would be absolutely TERRIBLE!!! I’m sorry that you can’t see that.
Besides, who said anything about standing pat and hoping a play maker falls into their laps in the 4th – 6th rounds? The first 3 rounds are generall where the playmakers should come from. The 4th – 6th rounds are for OL, depth, STs players and projects.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
when the Jets will have 10-11 draft picks would be absolutely TERRIBLE!!! I’m sorry that you can’t see that.
uh…we only have 7 rounds. Where do you see that we have 10-11 draft picks???
If you've been paying attention
you know that the Jets will probably get 3-4 compensatory draft picks for FAs they lost. They’ll probably get one in the 5th, one in the 6th and one in the 7th for sure and possibly another 6th.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
so you would rather we have a plethora of late round picks
picks which have a statistically low chance of sticking with a team as opposed to having the flexibility to move up in the draft to acquire a player.
Yes
because those picks represent players that at a minimum could be solid backups, or could even be solid starters. Look at Slauson. In addition, that is the place to get a P and K if the Jets plan on upgrading those positions. Traditionally, that’s where most OL and LB depth comes from and STs players.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
so instead of landing the next Ray Lewis or Terrell Suggs
you want us to get a bunch of Trevor Canfields, Ellis Lanksters and Caleb Schauderaffs? Because you know what, those guys are all late round picks. Not only that but they’re late round picks we nabbed from other teams!
Go ahead and look at the names of the players from rounds 4-7 for any draft. Chances are, you don’t know their names,and they’re not with the team that drafted them.
You're Not Gonna Get
an elite prospect trading up with low round draft choices. That’s nuts! You’re going to extremes, which only proves how off the mark you are. Thank goodness most people have sense enough to realize how ridiculous your statement is.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
I never said we'd get elite players by using ONLY late round choices
burning picks aren’t the only way to move up and down in the draft. Teams have often swapped picks to move up and down. You can call me ridiculous all you want by your extreme aversion to trading ANY picks is not the consensus.
In fact, I liken your pessimism of the Jets and die-hard need to retain all your picks to people that were against ‘moneyball’ and a sabermetric/statistics driven approach to player acquisition, which it seems like Tanny is looking at. And we all know how important sabermetrics has become to baseball and it’s emerging influence in the other sports.
I feel like the reason Tanny has sucess in the draft
is because he finds the 3 or 4 guys he really really likes, and does what he needs to do to get them.
First winner of the Golden Rex
Schottenheimer: "46 Left motion right over under bear 24 cat 65 triple left right up down on three"
Sione: "What is the offense doing?"
Rex: "I don’t know, but it won’t be a first down"
+1
I know I'm human, and that's my greatest weakness. But, I never let it stop me, and that's my greatest strength. - Frank Castle
He Doesn't Have Success
Look at the holes and the almost total lack of depth. That’s ALL on Tanny and his trading up, taking a RB every year, trading picks, and the like. If you guys can’t see that, then you should take up another sport.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
Thats not true...
depth is just as easily, if not more so, found in UDFA, and other teams cuts. Round 4-7 picks rarely make a difference, and are often cut by most teams within a year or two. Look at the Pats as prime examples, all those picks the last three years, and almost none have made any impact (the two TEs aside), they have had more success with grabbing players off other teams practice squads and cuts.
founding member of PACOS (People Against the Constant Overuse of Sarcastic font)
GGN-Moderator
It IS True
Sorry you can’t see that. UDFAs? Please. Yes, some of them make teams, develop and are very good players, but most of them don’t last in the NFL very long at all. There’s a reason they go undrafted. If you did research, you’d see that I was right.
The Pats have done a horrible job with ALL their picks or almost all recently, so they’re not the team to use as an example to prove your point.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
Don't have
much confidence in T but, more importantly, I have less in the scouting department, which is where any possible success in later round picks originates. There are several teams that do better with their 6th, 7th and UDFA’s than we do…hence our serious depth issues. Wish Woody would overspend in that department as we likely will have several late round compensation picks this April.
+1
there are plenty of teams out there that use UFDAs, and FAs from other teams to build depth. I don’t think people are really paying attention to the lack of success that later round players have in sticking with their first team. Wish someone would do an analysis of it.
I'm Sorry, I Know That Was Too Harsh
But you guys are smarter than that. Open your eyes. Don’t just drink the Kool-Aid. Study NFL history. Look at how teams like the Steelers and Packers have been built.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
I agree 100%,T is an ineffective GM!
T doesnt have the results to back his delusion of quality over quantity. We have in his 6 years only two players in Mangold and Revis who are considered top talent. We have had 4 qb changes , and possibly going on 5! Yes we had some smoke screens , then right after, fall right back to mediocrity like we are now. That shows he cant build a team for the long haul and just provides the teases which eventually become exposed. Yes , he is a cap guro, but there is much more involved. Its not just making space, its making space and building and upgrading the team through efficient talent evaluation in which he has been suspect. We are not sitting here with all these needs that just didnt pop up overnight, they are from years of his mismanagement. We still dont have our pass rusher, pour D has gotten slower and older and the depth on the oline is again, one starter going down to another tanked season! And he has the gaul and arrogance to say it his only his draft and he will do what he wants? Very encouraging!
Depth
i think this lack of depth was just this past year, not replacing Woody, letting Braylon, Brad Smith walk. and not resigning guys like Digs and T Rich, and trading away Lowery. that’s why there was little depth not because of his drafts. most of his drafts have been solid and brought in starters. 09 was 3 picks yes, but they are all key contributors. 2010 we got a solid 3rd CB in Wilson and a FB, RB, and OL (Ducasse still could turn out to be good) and last year he got D line with Wilk, and Ellis. picked up Kerley and a few others. i dont think saying hes unsuccessful in drafts, i would say just this past off-season he failed to find proper replacements.
Cant an average guy do what tanny does, target 3 players everyone knows would pan out. Tanny should start finding those hidden gems in rounds 4 – 7. If that SOB trades up then he is really clueless. We cannot keep trading away draft picks. Time to start adding solid depths on this team.
by overloadblitz on Feb 26, 2012 7:57 AM EST up reply actions
No The averge GM can't
If that was the case Revis, Mangold, & Harris would have been picked earlier.
Sure all GM’s target certain guys – even ‘He cannot beat Coughlin’, but they target the WRONG guys. In Tanny’s case at least he targets the right guys that make an impact and are studs.
I know I'm human, and that's my greatest weakness. But, I never let it stop me, and that's my greatest strength. - Frank Castle
I'm fine with him trading up even in first
I hear what you’re all saying but Tanny done a GREAT job when he trades up, Revis & Mangold are the BEST in the league at their positions. Keller & Harris are very good. When he target’s someone – he does well. When he wait’s for the draft to come to him his record is not as good – Ducasse, Wilson, he who will go nameless at pick 6. If he targets a guy who’ll be top 2 or 3 at his position in the league and goes to get him, I’m fine with it. The multiple picks of he who can’t beat Coughlin in a Superbowl have for the most part turned out to not be good players. I’ll take 4 – 5 real players over 10 scrubs every draft.
I know I'm human, and that's my greatest weakness. But, I never let it stop me, and that's my greatest strength. - Frank Castle
This draft I cannot say it would be wise to give away picks.
We need depth this year that I think the draft this year could provide. Sure, if the price is right and a good enough player presents itself you can draft up, but we really need to focus on getting players that can fill in our holes.
I don't think we should be super furious with our trades like we were in 09
but depending on what happens in FA and what the depth looks like going into the draft, i’m not completely opposed to trading up a couple spots here or there.
By the way, this just in: Vlad is gonna compete for the starting RT job, and the Jets are not expected to draft a lineman in the early rounds. I made a fanshot about it.
should have kept Baxter and let Vlad on the practice squad or cut him
by MetalVagabond on Feb 25, 2012 8:44 PM EST up reply actions
Baxter?
OMG!!! You either have to be high, have never watched a football game before, or be related to Baxter!!! LOL!!! He showed absolutely nothing. He was terrible and he was a UDFA. They knew it was gonna take some time with Ducasse and he had no offseason last year.
A democracy cannot exist as a permanent form of government. It can only exist until the voters discover that they can vote themselves largesse from the public treasury. From that moment on, the majority always votes for the candidates promising the most benefits from the public treasury with the result that a democracy always collapses over loose fiscal policy followed by a dictatorship. The average age of the world’s greatest civilizations has been 200 years." Alexander Tyler
Arrogance is not good,it shows weakness!
Yeah T , you tanked our season last year and left us with needs all over the place. Your flashes and then falling back to mediocrity show your quality over quantity is a delusion. What, only two picks in the last 6 years that are considered top talent? 4 qb changes and now possibly going on 5! A team that has depth and mid level talent needs all over the place! Where is our pass rush and faster d, depth on the oline that has been an issue for years? I will tell you where, they dont exist due to your ineffective talent evaluations and poor building philosophy with going for the big splashes and other teams malcontents. Where is our game changer on offense? You talk big for quality but have not walked the walk enough to overide all your failures! Now you say you will do what you want with your arrogance. It is not just your draft , it is the jet organizations draft also!Yeah you think its just all your draft, but for how much longer?!
by joeyboy790 on Feb 25, 2012 8:22 PM EST reply actions 1 recs
Arrogance is GREAT
when you back it up. It’s obnoxiousness that’s really not so good & shows signs of weakness. I actually thing he’s backed it up, but that obviously debatable and has many that disagree.
I know I'm human, and that's my greatest weakness. But, I never let it stop me, and that's my greatest strength. - Frank Castle
He makes sense and he doesn't
Its true that he has traded up and gotten good players. On the other side, he didn’t really have to sometimes. I think they traded up to draft Bilal Powell or Joe McKnight. There’s not really a need. And, when you trade your draft picks and wind up with 4 guys every year, it means you have to sign veterans for 1 and 2 million dollar deals when there’s a 4th or 5th round pick that would have cost 200k to do the same backup role.
I'm starting to hear this name pop up frequently.
Ladarius Green TE from Louisiana-Lafayette. He’s got great size and speed and I think would be a steal for us in the later rounds.
Jets/Yankees/Knicks
Let's Make sure we play like the f***in NEW YORK JETS
and not some f***in slapd**k team!
by jets4life24 on Feb 26, 2012 1:40 AM EST via mobile reply actions
I like Michael Egnew
He’s like 6’4, 250, he can block, he ran a 4.6, and he had a really good vert jump and broad jump. I think he’d make a good mauler-type TE that can also catch the ball to keep defenses honest.
Keller is 6-2 250 and he can't maul shit.
If you want a mauler, you’re looking for a guy around 270.
We pretty much have the exact opposite approach
to putting a team together that the Pats/Steelers/Giants use. It’s called the “I never want to win a SuperBowl” strategy.
Honestly, when Tom Brady gets inducted into the hall of fame
He should have Mo Lewis be his presenter. Seriously, what would he be without Mo Lewis?
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