When a Contract Isn't a Contract
by Crackback on Sep 1, 2010 2:28 PM EDT
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Kellen Clemens went into training camp with a $1.1M contract to play back-up quaterback for the NY Jets and a promise that there would be an open competition for the number 2 position behind Mark Sanchez. However, that wasn't to be the case. Before training camp even opened Rex publicly stated that Mark Brunell was to be the second head hancho of the offense. Understandably, Clemens was none too pleased. But hey, its hard to feel too bad for a guy who's got a heck of a contract to be the 3rd quarterback option, right? Hold your horses.
This past Monday Jets approached Clemens and presented him with the option of either playing for half of his current contract or being cut. Kind of a strong way to approach a guy thats home-grown and hasn't said boo to every slap in the face that he's endured over the years. "But wait," you say, "Rex told him he could look for another opportunity elsewhere if he liked." But would you want to uproot your family and move to another city, have to learn a new system and develop new relationships when you're probably not going to make any more money than you're making now? You probably wouldn't. Don't forget, Clemens had a $1.1M contract at the time he entertained offers from elsewhere. Who knows how his decision would have been effected if he knew that he would have been making only $600k here.
Did the Jets deal with Clemens fairly? Some would say no. A contract is a contract and it should be honored. Eh, I'm less concerned about them ripping up the old deal than I am about the deceitful and underhanded way that they undermined Clemens' leverage. I believe that if they wanted to deal with Clemens fairly, they should have ripped up his $1.1M contract the minute they named Brunell as the number 2 guy, and let him entertain offers from other teams while knowing exactly where he stood with the Jets. But the Jets were very scumbaggish in how they handled this situation. Even Rex came off as untruthful.
Rex told reporters that Clemens' talent and performance dictated that he would be a Jet this season. But apparently he backtracked awkwardly after being confronted with evidence of the team's demand, Ryan said: "Obviously, he'd [have been] cut if he didn't take it. [But] from his skill, we were not looking to cut Kellen." Clemens told reporters after the last practice before tomorrow's preseason finale at Philadelphia that the ultimatum about a pay cut had come from Jets GM Mike Tannenbaum and Ryan himself in a Monday meeting. http://www.nypost.com/p/sports/jets/kell_bent_to_stay_J8rYGPB5iHfjqGhIi6h7cO#ixzz0yIlvJMGX
Basically the Jets warded off any potential options for Clemens to play elsewhere, then, when it was too late for him to be taken on by another team, they presented him with a take it or leave it 50% reduction in pay. Nice.
Of course this ties into the Revis saga. I don't really mind the Jets strong-arming Clemens into a lesser deal. I do, however, take issue with the way they did it. They manipulated the situation to remove any real possibility of losing him and then basically forced him to take less money. He really has no value to another team at this point because he's had no time to learn a new system. But teams do this sort of thing all the time to players. They manipulate the situation and strong-arm them at any and every opportunity under the guise of "whats best for the team." Most of the time its almost criminally unfair. But business is business. This is why I have no problem with Revis playing the same game and manipulating the situation to suit his interests.
Unlike most others, I don't think Revis' demands are out of step with what's fair. Considering what other top defenders are making and adjusting for inflation, Revis' demands are right about where they should be, IMO. But thats neither here nor there. I would only ask that before Revis critics froth at the mouth and shake their fists at the heavens at what they believe is Revis' greedy and unjust demands, take a look at this Clemens situation. Look at Clemens and ask yourself if everything Woody and Tanny and Rex tell you is true. Ask yourself if they are really dealing with him on the up and up. Ask yourself if its wrong for Revis to fight for what he believes is right. Ask yourself if the Jets will really take care of him down the road if he'll just take a little less now. Ask yourself if a contract is really a contract.
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You know what I have defended the Jets on most subjects
But I don’t like this Clemens shake down at all. It seems like they approached him right before the rest of the NFL starts to scramble for QB options and left him with am impossible decision. Don’t get me wrong Kellen made the decision to take less money but I don’t like what the Jets did here. We all know he is really the second string QB, Brunell has no arm strength at all. If he ends up being the number 2 QB I think he should get his money back. 1.1 million is a lot less then backup QBs usually make.
"Sorry bro, he Jason Bourned me"- Drama
But Crack...lol
I kind of saw Revis getting worked into this some how..
"Sorry bro, he Jason Bourned me"- Drama
Now that he's making less money...
if he plays better than Brunell tomorrow night, can Clemens become the backup again? Mike T. would look like a genius.
and the home of the... JETS!!!
www.ganggreennation.com
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
Totally agree. Kellen knows the system better and the personnel better. Not only has he played better but the players trust him more. Rex seems to be praising Clemens skills more. Doesn’t it seem like the Jets refused to say he was competing for the #2 spot just so they could now force a pay cut on him. He clearly has played himself into the #2 job. If sanchez goes down who thinks Brunell will stay at #2 for more than Qtr?
So…Tanny saves 600K here, couple hundred K to maybe a mil on Coles and maybe AT. Tanny is real creative, that’s almost 2mil Or the diference between the 14mil Revis should get and the 16mil he wants. WOW and he didn’t have to get rid of our Core just shaft the #3 QB and a couple of stop gap vets!
that was just sarcasm. I want Revis to compromise so we can add depth, but come on, Tanny can be creative and find ways to make Revis happy and field a good team. That’s why I don’t buy we will be cap strung if we give in to Revis.
This whole Brunell thing just plain stinks.
And Crack, your post brings back memories of what the FO did to TJ. For him to have a career year and just cut him like that? It hurt. TJ was my favorite back on the team.
We can’t forget how they just dropped Chad like a bad habit. It goes on and on…
BTW Crack, I know you'll get a kick out of this one
http://benmaller.com/2010/09/nfl-star-in-crowd-at-justin-bieber-concert/
Why was Sanchez at a Bieber concert? Shouldn’t he be home STUDYING FILM?!
Maybe he thought it was Tom Brady.
and the home of the... JETS!!!
www.ganggreennation.com
If you're not part of the solution, you're part of the precipitate.
I love our players but I can't get mad at the front office because...
9/10 jobs no matter what profession you choose, if you are under contract to an employer you go thru training, visit HR, do the bullshit orientation and all of this is so you are not caught by surprise….more importantly so the employers cover their assess legally speaking.
NFL is the same, these players know what they are getting into. They have a union behind them as well as lawyers and agents so there is no excuse for a player not to be informed or not know what the stipulations of his contract are.
Guess what? If you under perform and make too much money….sooner or later your boss will fire you.
If anyone wants to cyber stalk my previous comments you’ll find that I feel like Kellen Clemens was never given a fair shot since he was drafted. I can now add that I’m happy Kellen got the money he did previously but I sure as hell won’t feel bad he got a
pay cut.
He at least got the option of a pay cut. Lets be here, If I’m Clemens duck yea I’m taking and spending the overvalued contract they gave me but when they realize it was overvalued I should realize something’s gotta give. In most professions including the NFL you aren’t given a choice, you get canned and that’s it.
And for everyone who says “oh, look at the poor players. they can get cut and have their contracts voided with no notice!”
My reply…so what!?! you ever looked at a standard employment agreement? It is written right there , probably the last statement before you sign…The employer has the right and ability to terminate this contract at any time.
It’s common practice, a contract is a contract and it should be honored. That is why they have a union. If they have a problem with not being paid due to a cut, then organize a strike once the labor agreement is up with that issue as a sticking point.
The wrong thing to do would be sign contract, accept money then when contract no longer suits your taste renig. The teams only have this option because the players agree to it. If these players man up and take care of business then they’d be ballin like in the NBA where if you’re cut the team still owes your salary until someone else picks you up.
What did the 5 fingers say to the face?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R7CBwX1891A
HaHaHaHa!
by Lord Smackington on Sep 1, 2010 4:22 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
Clemens is lucky to even be in the NFL.He's had chances to win the starting QB
job over Pennington twice and Sanchez(a rookie) and came up way short.There would be little to no interest in Clemens and third string QB’s make the minimum.Clemens has done nothing to prove he belongs in this league.
crackback, why does the “I hate Revis” crowd ignore Tanny’s business shennanigans when deriding Revis’s motives? Why are we supposed to believe every FO excuse, leaked story and denial as if Tanny is Honest Abe?
by george JETson on Sep 1, 2010 11:52 PM EDT up reply actions
Wish i knew gearge. I don’t get it. The team exploit these guys to the tilt, and the minute a player fights for whats fair for him he gets demonized.
not that simple
I think both sides have fault, I’m not gonna let Revis shoulder the whole thing but the negative backlash he faces is deserved because of the holdout and because of his actions and statements prior to his holdout.
He’s under contract so he should be playing period. His argument is if he is injured he won’t be able to provide for his family unless he gets the contract with the numbers he’s comfortable with, he is thinking about his future…I call bull shit.
Fuck what he’s scheduled to earn this year, he’s earned 15M playing with us thus far. Who in god’s name can not support their family having earned 15M unless your buying diamond studded diapers and caviar flavored toothpaste for your children.
This is about money, he knows they have it and he wants it.
They shouldn’t give it to him just because they have it, that is one of the first lessons in handling money. Those who spend money just because they have it are irresponsible.
If you offer me 50 bucks to help you move, Last time when I helped you move out of your shitty ass apartment I did all the heavy lifting and was the fastest most dedicated lifter there. I was the best at moving furniture hands down. Your cousin stopped for a cigarette break 15 mins in right after moving a damned rocking chair. You thanked me more than enough times and promised you’d look out for me.
So now I get to new home and see you’ve moved up in the world. Everyone is talking about your nice shit, your loaded and very well off…Now don’t I look like a dick if after having already accepting your 50 bucks I refuse to do any work whatsoever unless you pay me 250 for the move I already agreed to? Yea I knew what was involved but after all, I was the best mover, right? And it definitely looks like your living well these days, so you can afford it right??? So you should just give me what I ask for right?
What did the 5 fingers say to the face?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R7CBwX1891A
HaHaHaHa!
by Lord Smackington on Sep 2, 2010 3:38 PM EDT up reply actions
who gives a crap about what they are saying (either way)
I side with the front office because the front office is not doing anything wrong, they are playing by the rules. You may not like it, but the NFLPA agreed to the current situation, and Revis agreed to his current contract. When negotiating a contract it is known by the player what options the team has to cut or renegotiate, and that is how its negotiated, it is why there are signing bonuses and guaranteed money. The player does not have the right to holdout when under contract, it is not expected, at this point he should be made to give back signing bonuses, but alas that doesn’t happen.
Of course he has the right and of course there’s an expectation. He is fined accordingly, and he willingliy pays that fine. If it wasn’t exoected three wouldn’t be a fine allotted in the contract.
If he’s being fined, he doesn’t have the right, its actually that he doesn’t have the right, thats why he’s being fined.
NFL teams aren’t fined for cutting players.
Crack, Revis is in violation of his contract, and is doing something against NFL policy, It’s what makes you 100% wrong on any of your arguments, the hold out is not something he has a right to do, but something he can do. I can speed, and can get pulled over a fined for that, but I certainly don’t have the right to speed.
The one thing the FO did wrong was
approaching Revis about a contract extension.
He has violated neither. The contract/policy simply states that if he fails to provide services, then he is required to pay a certain sum. He’s not in violation so long as h pays that sum. If he pays, he is compliant. This is understood between the the union and the league as well as the player and the organization.
You can’t compare a contract situation with a statutory/regulatory infraction. When it comes to the laws of the land, there is no contract. There is no negotiating and hashing out of the terms when it comes to the law. The government is in absolute control over what is and isn’t a crime. The people, although influential through the electoral process, really have veryy little say about what is and isn’t a law.
Contracts are different. Revis’ contract merely states that if he fails to show up, he has to pay a certain sum to the Jets. So long as he pays that sum, his actions are pernissable within the letter of contract. Yeah the Jets can void the contract if they so choose, but they could do that anyway, at any time for any reason.
Revis is well within his rights contractually, legally and morally in this situtation.
OMFG Crack you sir are delusional, you can talk yourself into anything.
he lost a year of service, how about that, is that not punishment. He is in breach of his contract. In no way shape or form are holdouts while under contract, acceptable, or permitted by the NFL spin it however you want, Revis is wrong here, and you’ve been hit over the head with that a 100 times. Every argument you’ve presented has been filled with holes.
contract
Yeah, to mevis a contract is not a contract. He held out before and now doing it again.
Crack, seems you getting to be a sanchez hater from all you posts about him. I think we should sign football revis and have him also play QB. I’m sure he can do that also along with being a 1 man defense against 11 offensive players. Then we’ll give him 30 million a year and save money. Seems since mevis is not signed seems your slowly not liking the jets.
Sorry but I just won’t step over into unreality with all the others who seem to think that Rex and Tanny can do no wrong. And yeah, Im startin to hate on Sanchez, you can say that.
Sanchez sucks and Im tired of making excuses for him. He’s not supposed to be as clueless as he is right now. He goes through the motions and says all the right things, but on the field he still looks like he’s overwhelmed. But I look at him and Kellen Clemens as equals right now. Why shouldn’t Clemens get a shot with this o-line and running game and set of receivers? He’s paid a hell of a lot more dues than Sanchez. Sanchez has had everything handed to him on a silver platter and yet he still refuses to progress; and people continue to lie to him and themselves and sing his praises. I want to see progress. If he’s clearly not better than Clemens then his ass should ride the pine.
And I’m starting to hate the FO and Rex too. Woody is a douchbag, Tanny seems like a lying snake and Rex seems more concerned about having fun than guiding his team. Yeah Rex will get in the defense’s ass. We heard him tell the defense that giving up a TD is unacceptable, and he meant it. But he STILL doesn’t coach the offense, he still treats Sanchez with kid gloves. He’s still just a DC and not an HC.
And its no secret that I think this team is better with Revis. And I don’t blame him at all for playing his cards this way. But Tanny needs to stop F-ing around and either pay him or move him. If he pays him, then he’s a douche for not paying him earlier. If he doesn’t pay him, then he’s a douche for not moving him and getting something back in return.
Ok, now say the team gives Clemens a shot;
and if he ends up Sanchez for the next two years and beyond. After the 2011 season (if there is one) Clemens wins us a championship. Would you call Sanchez and Clemens into the office and make them switch contracts? lol Just askin’.
better
I also think this team is better with mevis and I think everyone else does but the hold out is getting old and almost everyone is getting tired of it. Could care less about the FO just the team and the coaches. I want to see some good football and hope the preseason was just a tune up and not the things to come. The team is what it is on opening day and if they fall on their asses then I won’t be too happy. We’ll see!
I felt really bad for Clemens after seeing Hard Knocks last night.
Oh, and why is Brunell the number 2?
Darrelle Revis once won a game of Connect Four in three moves.
OMFG Crack really...
get over this hatred of NFL front offices, and the somewhat cruel nature of the sport.
Clemens would not have gotten more (or at least much more) than the Jets are paying him from any other team (if he was released at the start of camp, which would have been stupid leaving us with only three QBs). They held on to him, and showcased him in hopes someone would wan’t to trade for him, because he has value to them. But you know what he’s not worth anything to anyone else, and did not show enough.
This is the NFL, all the players and agents know the rules, they know what teams can do, they know they can be cut, and negotiate their contracts with that knowledge in place. So you see thats where your dead wrong, when you try to defend Revis. HE signed and held out for a contract knowing full well what the teams options were, he got front loaded money, bonuses, and guaranteed money, because he agreed to said contract. The team agreed to this deal not knowing Revis would not adhere to it, and would against league rules hold out when under contract. So while you may not love the system, you have to understand its what was agreed to, and thats why your wrong.
Don't forget the agents' role Judge
Just Sayin’.
In what regards?
I mean the agent certainly has some ulterior motives in the whole process (but it doesn’t changed the agreed upon process, by the NFLPA and the NFL) but his hiring is 100% up to the player, and therefore completely his responsibility. If the agent is telling him to break his contract, the player is still the one breaking the contract.
player
That’s a fact. Mevis is not on a string, he knows what he’s doing, he’s done it before. He can tell his agents or uncle I’m going back screw you guys, but chooses to do what he’s doing. As a player I really think he’s awesome but as a teammate, and having honor he sucks.
I don't agree with his holdout
But his agents are TOTAL AND COMPLETE DOUCHEBAGS! Revis is BY FAR their best client. Their also whispering in his ear “you’ll end up like Leon if you play this year.” He stated already he wants more money, now if he goes back and gets injured he’s totally screwed…
I think he should have reported, and the Jets would have def bought back his two years fully guaranteed. If he knew anything, he would have fired these idiots and got two better agents. He should focus on football, and get knowledgeable, trustworthy agents to handle the contract negotiations. I also believe he hasn’t been involved in these talks at all, and that’s a real big problem because obviously these two assholes don’t know wtf their doing. The only thing they see is Green, and it’s not Jets Green.
yep
that’s the thing, he wants to hold out as a rookie before he has a contract fine. But don’t sign the contract then hold out when you feel it doesn’t suit you anymore.
What did the 5 fingers say to the face?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R7CBwX1891A
HaHaHaHa!
by Lord Smackington on Sep 2, 2010 4:27 PM EDT up reply actions
I don’t hate FOs amd I don’t hate the system, but i im not gonna hate on a player that has the ability to leverage his situation in his own interests when the team does that very thing on a daily basis.
The team agreed to this deal not knowing Revis would not adhere to it
The team was just as aware of the possibility of Revis holding out as Revis is/was of the team’s ability to cut him at any time for any reason. They stipulated that if he held out he would be fined a certain amount for each day. It seems that he’s paid his fines accordingly. The idea that the Jets are somehow wronged by his holdout is ludicrous.
how are the jet's not wronged by his holdout???
it’s not helping them, that’s for sure. And as mentioned before paying fines is a penalty…penalties are for when you break the rules. Just because he’s paying fines doesn’t mean he’s in the right, It just means he’s acknowledging the rules he’s already broken.
What did the 5 fingers say to the face?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R7CBwX1891A
HaHaHaHa!
by Lord Smackington on Sep 2, 2010 5:45 PM EDT up reply actions
They’re making money is why theyre not wronged. Not only do they not have to pay Revis, Revis has to pay them.
wow crack
that reply was wrong on so many levels. They’re not making money, Revis is being penalized because he’s not upholding a contract.
Either you’re one of his agents and you’re spreading the hate, or you’ve never signed (and read) a contract in your entire life.
The team was just as aware of the possibility of Revis holding out as Revis is/was of the team’s ability to cut him at any time for any reason.
Thats BS, a team has a right to cut or renegotiate at any time (its why they pay bonuses and give guarantees), a player does not have the right to hold out, its why he’s fined. He is violating NFL policy that is not the norm that is the exception.
The player absolutely has the right to hold out, so long as he pays the sum agreed upon. Which is why the commissioner has not taken any action in this situation.
No he does not. Crack holdouts are not punishable by the commissioner in that way, but he certainly does not have the right he is also being punished by having a year of service negated. He is in breach of his NFL contract, he has the free will to hold out but certainly not the right.
He's not breaking the law or anything
its just the rules to a game.
if he was doing anything wrong then he would be sued by the jets. Hes paying fines because he can do that instead of playing. When you see your team disrepecting player that they signed to a contract then you feel this could happen to you. And now we know that for a fact the Jets are willing to exploit its players so why not exploit the team.
by Patsfan4life on Sep 2, 2010 11:46 PM EDT up reply actions
that's funny
cuz I don’t remember the Pats being all buddy buddy with their own players. Logan Mankins anyone? Or how about your savvy vets that you just got rid of? Or how about Deion Branch?
Don’t tell me the Jets are exploiting its players when the Pats try to exploit just about everything under the sun. Tuck rule, spygate, and the list goes on…
dont compare Revis to Mankins
thats apples and oranges, Tuck rule give it up thats years ago, spygate your one of those guys damn. Swavy vets yeah saying that makes a point. Deion Branch we dont talk about him anymore.
Breaking the law? Its football of course not...
but he is breaking a labor agreement, and a contract he signed.
Yeah what he is doing seems like BS
but every time the jets fine him thats just money hes gonna want back in this new contract so that not fixing anything.
Second string, third string, does it really matter
I mean they want Brunell on the field to dress and step in for a snap or two in case Sanchez is out for a series, or a game. But I think if it was a major injury, or Sanchez was out for the year, Clemens would be the starter.
I’m totally digging this article, and then WHAM! I get hit in the face with more whining for Mevis. Should’ve seen it coming.
Easy to differentiate these two completely unrelated issues, but I’ll spell it out anyway: Case 1 illustrates the Jets scumbagging Clemens. Case 2 is the story of Mevis scumbagging the Jets.
Stop whining about Revis
you sound so desperate. There’s no way you can reasonably defend someone that held out on the same contract TWICE.
he didnt hold out on it twice
he didnt have a contract the 1st time, this time hes just doing to the jets what they do to others, screwing them out of money.
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