Should Antonio Cromartie Be Used to Cover Wes Welker?
by Crackback on Aug 25, 2010 4:28 PM EDT
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Recently I've been thinking about our secondary and how we would match up against some of the good passing attacks that we'll be facing this year. [I'm operating under the assumption that Revis is resigned]. We've been led to believe that WIlson will be covering the slot while Revis and Cro will be locking it down on the outside. The match-up where that scares the bejesus out of me, though, is where rookie Kyle Wilson would be going up against Wes Welker. The week 2 game in particular. Wilson very well may be a good cover guy. But the idea of Brady and Welker against a rookie, ANY rookie, just seems like shooting fish in a barrel. However, the idea of using Cro on Welker seems very intriguing, to me at least.
Wilson seems to be more in the Revis mold than in the Cro mold. Meaning Wilson seems to be the type that likes to jam and disrupt/redirect the rout and then use his athletic ability to cover. It seems like his style is more akin to Revis' in that it is technique driven. They disrupt timing then use the side-line and their positioning to lock it down. Cro seems to rely more on his instincts and athleticism. Despite is size advantage, he doesn't seem to rely on jamming very much. He seems to like to just lock onto guys and uses his length and speed and hawking skills to make up for lost ground.
So why Cro on Welker rather than Wilson?
Welker and Brady have tremendous chemistry and timing. Welker working out of the slot makes it very difficult, if not impossible, to get a good jam on him. This will likely make Wilson much less effective in coverage on Welker, and his inexperience will make him much more succeptible to manipulation (especially in week 2). Cro's length, quickness and speed will make it much more difficult for Welker to get separation (Cro is 6'2" 210 to Welker's 5'9" 185). Cro closes so quickly that he can give up an initial step to Welker and can recover easily. Because of Cro's length, Welker would have to get that much more separation from him in order to get completely open. Also, Brady will be slightly more hesitant to throw a ball within Cro's reach because of his hawking skills and ability to take it to the house. And there's just no way Welker is separating from Cro on a deep route.
This seems to be the best way for the Jets D to attack the Pats O. We all know Revis can erase Moss, and I for one am much more comfortable with Wilson covering the Pats 3rd best receiver on the outside rather than arguably their best receiver in the slot. Cro seems to be big enough and quick enough that his size-athleticism combo may give Brady and Welker fits.
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I don't know if I agree with you on Wilson coverage tendencies.
I have yet to see anything that leds me to believe that he likes to jam at the line. In fact I tend to notice him taking steps backward as the ball is about to be snapped. That indicates to me that he is still relying on his closing speed and coverage basics to help him. He also looks tentative at times with his distance to the WR. I do agree that Welker and Brady would rip him apart tho. So thats out
Cro on the other hand is a “baiter”. He likes to create a slight space between the WR and close in a flash when he sees the QB load. This for me screams Randy Moss all the way. I don’t care what ppl say about him. Randy has lost a few steps on his top end speed. I think Cro can bait Brady to throw his way and easily out fight Moss for the ball. Also Cro’s running stride is too long and fluid. Not conducive for the quick cutting and and improvised routes that Welker and , for that matter, Edelman will run.
Revis on Welker would be my choice all the way. Welker is Brady’s Wooby blanket. Just seeing #24 on him would initially give Brady reason to look elsewhere long enough for his blitz clock to start ticking.
I have always stated that Revis’ strength is the power in his legs. He can plant, cut and power through abrupt changes in a route just as fast as the WR. He’s also the best jammer in the league. If I were Rex I would tell Revis to absolutly RAPE Welker at the line. Get in his head the way he did with TO. That is the perfect answer to the Welker coverage problem. Will Revis give up a few? Yes. But he can keep the Pats off balance by taking away the player that keeps their tone and flow going.
All this is for one purpose and one purpose only. 3.8 seconds. Thats the time Brady will average when looking for a WR because at 4.0 seconds he’s on his back with an elbow in his jaw.
by colinyoung on Aug 25, 2010 5:10 PM EDT reply actions
I agree as well...
I’m just curious as to what will happen when he goes into motion and we can’t necessarily jam this dude.
GANG GREEN ALL DAY!
You see, it's not about how you won the game, it's about how you played the game.... there's a difference.
Thats kinda why I shied away from thinking Revis King. If there’s a chink in his armor, its covering crossing routes.
I kinda didn’t like the idea of using Cro on Moss because he’s prone to mental lapses. And with Moss a mental lapse means 6. Welker will beat him a few times and get some yards, but he’s not much of a TD threat.
Welker rewrites the reception record on a yearly basis.
If your saying Cro is prone to mental lapse. Then I want him covering Brandon Tate not the guy whos guaranteed to get the most touches in the entire game.
If Revis isn’t the best option then Im sorry to say we over paid for him. And you have to figure this coaching staff is going to fix Cro’s mental lapses. If this guy can’t dial in against a divisional rival and our arch enemy I have a serious problem with him.
Im sorry But Moss just does not get enough touches to warrant sticking Revis in his pocket all game.
That being said, These guys will be all over the place in reality.
by colinyoung on Aug 25, 2010 7:59 PM EDT up reply actions
You know I’d really like to see Revis cover Welker for an entire game, just to see how he handles him. He’s taken on the best of the best and shut them down, but Welker is a tricky customer to deal with. I have no idea how he does it but he gets open at the exact time the ball is in the air and ready to be caught. He kills us, but there are few players games in the NFL that I respect more than Wes Welkers.
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Randy Moss 2009
83 catches, 1264 yards, 13 TDs.
Welker had 123 catches, 1348 yards, 4 TDs.
There was a difference of 84 yards between them on the season, while Moss had almost 10 more TDs. Moss is by FAR the bigger threat.
To be fair Welker was battling some injuries, and started 3 less games than Moss. I think Cromartie can match up well with Moss with his size and length. I like Revis’s closing speed and short area quickness to deal with Welker. I’m just thinking about threat against us, rather than threat in general.
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Good points David
And I also think TDs can sometimes be a result of random circumstances, I mean I don’t have time right now but we could break down those 17 plays that resulted in touchdowns for those two pretty quickly. Also I think Moss relies a lot on his athleticism, and we’ve seen that Revis can shut down Moss, so worst case scenario we can move him onto Moss if he really is having that great of a game, but Welker has killed us even more so than Moss in recent years and I want to see him get shut down.
Although as I think about this more maybe it becomes a situational thing where Revis shifts onto Welker on 3rd down to prevent conversions, but that could be tough for him to adjust his coverage that fast from Moss to Welker
It depends on what you mean by threat. Your stats are subject to interpretation.
Welker keeps drives alive, converts third downs and comes up big whenever Brady needs him .Moss is a TD threat thats true. But offenses have to be quicker in the pocket to begin with because of this defense. That means less time for moss to get open. Moss was called out for playing soft last year. Revis could take him out of his game in less than a quarter and move on to Welker.
by colinyoung on Aug 25, 2010 8:20 PM EDT up reply actions
This will not be the same Wes Welker after the injury he suffered last season.
Seems slower and has problems with the hard cuts that he runs his patterns off.
by Putnan Prince on Aug 25, 2010 9:01 PM EDT up reply actions
Definitely!
I agree with you on this one. I like how you added the “elbow in his jaw” part at the end there…. lol
"To be honest with you, it could've used a little more Cowbell!"
Just mix it up,
I don’t think Moss is dominant enough anymore that I would be afraid of putting Cromartie on him a little bit. Switch all 3 around and disguise some coverage, don’t let Brady get into a rhythm.
I also wouldnt recomend Revis D up Welker on every play
3rd and long. You could roll the saftey to Moss to double with Wilson. Thats right, Wilson. Notice: the only way that works is if Wilson protects the middle of the field. He can’t let Moss cross the field on a deep in. Cro can handle Welker if the marker is far enough away that he can give space initially and close quickly. Really quickly. And why not give Revis the chance to bury his pads in Brady’s girlish midsection on a corner blitz?
by colinyoung on Aug 25, 2010 5:31 PM EDT reply actions
I agree to some extent, however
I’d prefer Wilson there to make the tackle, instead of Cro missing it and him going another 5-10 yards.
lol.
I would hope Cro could handle finishing off Weker on a tackle. Or mabye Im being silly.
by colinyoung on Aug 25, 2010 5:36 PM EDT up reply actions
Remember Welker running over Kerry Rhodes last year? is Cromartie a better tackler than Kerry may be a question worth pondering.
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That might be the answer to the question actually.
The best defense a corner has against Wes is sound tackling. Im realistic about Cro being gun shy. If he misses one tackle Rex will stick #24 on him the rest of the game.
by colinyoung on Aug 25, 2010 8:11 PM EDT up reply actions
Unfortunately that one missed tackle could be the game. This is interesting because I don’t think there is a right or wrong answer. Only estimations, and people see things in different ways.
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I think if there was one clear point to make in my case...
on why Cro should not cover Wes. It would be their style of play. Welker does not follow typical passing routes. His strength is his change of direction, double moves and hard cuts. Cro Is long and fluid. His strides are wide gallops. At the most basic level their play styles favor Wes in every way. A good QB would pick a defense apart that way.
It’s like asking a racing horse to catch a jack rabbit.
But to be honest, The upgrades to this secondary are so amazing that anybody covering anybody is an upgrade to what we had last year. Brady and his girls dont stand a chance. That team is so pass heavy at this point that it favors the jet defense even with Jenkins covering Wes. lol
by colinyoung on Aug 25, 2010 8:38 PM EDT up reply actions
Well I don't know about that...
you know it won’t be a TD, cause Welker almost never gets that far. Also when he catches it even if he gets by his man he still has to deal with the other two corners both safeties (if not blitzing) and anyone else more than 3 yards past the line of scrimmage, lol.
Changed the title crack so it is picked up better.
Interesting area of conversation though, which is why I’ve added it to the front page.
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why not
match up revis with welker and cro on moss…. moss is starting to lose a step and cro has the length and ability to match up with him well… as we all know whoever revis matches up with he shuts down… i would be more comfortable with revis on welker for majority of the game
by John Hart on Aug 25, 2010 7:22 PM EDT reply actions 1 recs
I think Wilson is the best matchup
He’s quicker than cromartie in tight spaces has the quick hip movements,needed to cover slant routes in my eyes along with jamming receivers up front.
Has anybody seen Wilson jam a WR to this point? I have not.
Revis is the best option.
by colinyoung on Aug 25, 2010 7:49 PM EDT up reply actions
I just dont think jamming Welker is realistic. Even if you get one on him succesfully, they’ll just start motioning him. Thats why i went Cro. He doesn’t rely on jamming and seems to get in and out of breaks quickly and he has all that length.
If the guys has his feet on the line of scrimage 6 times its enough for Revis to take him out of his game.
Playing him physical like he did TO and Ocho, Tackin em on running plays. Jamming them at the line and jawin in their ear are all things he does to take you out of your game. Moss is easy to get off his game. Welker is a harder egg to crack. Revis needs to be the guy that covers him at least 3/4 of the game.
by colinyoung on Aug 25, 2010 8:06 PM EDT up reply actions
I would double Welker a lot.
I would put Revis 1 V 1 with Moss, and have Cro, and Pool on Welker. Then put Predator on whoever they have on the outside… Who will probably be Eldermen or Tate.
Get busy winning or get busy losing.
Assuming Revis is back, they’ll mix it up.
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Yeah, they will put Revis on Welker sometimes, and double Moss. They don’t keep Revis on the number 1 guy the entire game.
Get busy winning or get busy losing.
by GangGreenMag on Aug 25, 2010 8:56 PM EDT up reply actions
Interesting....
I almost forgot about Eldermen and Tate…
If Welker and Moss are on the outside… I’d put Wilson and Revis (respectively) on them… and with Tate and Eldermen on the inside, I’d have Lowery and Cromartie on them respectively. I dunno, What say ye?
GANG GREEN ALL DAY!
You see, it's not about how you won the game, it's about how you played the game.... there's a difference.
Cro on Moss...
I like Cromartie’s size (6’2") to cover Moss (6’4"). On a deep ball, Brady’s going to get some serious air under it and I think have confidence that Cro can out-leap Randy. Remember, Randy has to catch it. Cro just has to get a hand on it to break it up.
I’d then throw Revis on Welker. I’d gladly give up 6 catches for 50 yards to Wes. That’s nothing for the guy.
Then Wilson on Edelman who I think Brady would have to resort to. Just bring the heat and have Bart watch out for the screen from time to time.
Question:
Who covers Rob Gronkowski/Aaron Hernandez/Julian Edelman/Brandon Tate, especially if Revis isn’t here for week 2?
Honestly… nobody. We’ll get smoked without Revis. It’ll be all we can handle even if we do have him. We just can’t score enough.
Losing Calvin Pace sucks...
…but your D-Line could feature Jenkins at end and Pouha at NT.
On offense, is Sanchez just not on target, is his timing off, are the receivers dropping the ball? Does it seem to be fixable stuff, or does Sanchez look like “just” a sophomore quarterback?
by Richard Hill on Aug 28, 2010 10:31 AM EDT up reply actions
I think someone may have alluded to it earlier
but I think they should all switch up and give Brady different looks as long as you’re not sticking Wilson or anyone but Cro or Revis on Moss one on one.
In 3 WR sets you could line two CB’s Revis plus whoever on Moss and as it’s snapped have Revis stay on Moss while the other corner brakes off and covers the slot along with a safety who has been faking a blitz.
If the Revis thing gets ironed out there is lots you can do, the way to beat Brady is to show him different looks and come at him hard and often.
What did the 5 fingers say to the face?
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=R7CBwX1891A
HaHaHaHa!
by Lord Smackington on Aug 30, 2010 12:51 PM EDT reply actions
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