My LT Rant
by John B on Mar 13, 2010 9:39 AM EST
23 comments
I was fine with letting Thomas Jones go. In fact, I probably would have let him go. It's not that hard to find quality young backs. It gave the Jets a chance to get younger and cheaper at the position. What I don't get is letting a locker room leader like Jones go for a guy almost as old, who will cost almost as much, and isn't half as productive.
LaDainian Tomlison is not a productive football player anymore. He ran for an abysmal 3.3 yard average per carry in 2009. You could argue his offensive line wasn't that great, but how then did his teammate Darren Sproles run for a significantly better 3.7 average? Thomas Jones ran for a 3.6 average with Adrien Clarke and Anthony Clement on his offensive line in 2007. TJ didn't have an elite passing attack to keep defenses honest like Tomlinson did either. Willie Parker, a player we discussed yesterday, had 3.8 and 4.0 averages over the past two seasons with a terrible blocking front.
Let's go a little deeper. Rich Cimini takes a lot of heat here, but he did a great job yesterday in an article looking in depth at how productive Tomlinson is.
MISCELLANEOUS RUSHING STATS (ACCORDING TO PRO FOOTBALL FOCUS)
Yards After Contact/Per Attempt -- 1.9 (Ranks 29th out of 29 RBs who appeared in at least 50% of team's offensive snaps)
Missed Tackles Caused -- 9 (Ranks 29th out of 29 RBs who appeared in at least 50%)
In other words, he's a back incapable of breaking tackles or making anybody miss. If he hits a wide open hole, sure he can pick up some yardage, but these stats show he doesn't have explosion to turn them into big runs like say a Willie Parker could.
I've heard some chatter he could turn into a third down back. As bad as having Tomlinson replacing Thomas Jones would be, having him take over this role for Leon Washington would be even worse in my book. Yes, he has a reputation of being a good pass catcher, but he set a career low of 20 receptions in 2009. It was the first year he had less than 51. That's a huge dropoff.
There are some positions where players age gracefully. Take wide receiver. Torry Holt has lost a lot of explosion, but he runs good enough routes and has good enough hands to help somebody in some capacity. Running back is different. When it goes, it goes quickly and never comes back. When a back whose entire game is based on athletic ability like Tomlinson loses that ability, it never comes back, and he ceases to be effective.
The other problem is we don't know how he will react to not being the guy. He's used to being the franchise player. It's easy to say you'll accept a reduced role in the offseason. How will he respond once he's sitting on the bench? Will he be happy? Will it affect his preparation.
He's a classy guy, but that's not enough to give a guy a contract. He'll likely be a Hall of Famer, but a team should pay for what it expects in the future, not for what a player has done in the past. That was part of the reason Thomas Jones was released. Why give a guy a contract for being the 2006 MVP if he can't produce in 2010? If he had more pedestrian stats and was not a superstar five years ago, would any team even sniff him? Doesn't anybody remember how ineffective he was in the Divisional Playoffs?
I want a productive player at the position. I would have been fine with a rookie the team could have developed for peanuts. I would have been fine with a guy like Willie Parker, capable of adding another dimension for cheap. I would have been fine with a guy like Brian Westbrook who might bring more to the table than Jones. What I can't live with is cutting a productive player and a locker room leader like Thomas Jones and paying about the same amount to a totally ineffective player.
This team makes a lot of moves with which I disagree. Take the Kerry Rhodes trade. I can at least understand the thought process there, though. Rhodes' attitude clearly didn't mix with the coaching staff. I don't love Antonio Cromartie, but if San Diego is going to offer a guy with his incredible natural ability for 40 cents on the dollar, you have to take it. This would make absolutely no sense to me, and I don't see how the team justifies it. Just because he was great in 2005 doesn't mean LT has a lot to offer today.
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I think Crackback had the right idea, in signing LD, we already have washington to fill the 3rd down role and pass catching role. So what will Tomlinson’s role on the team be, or what will Leon’s role on the team be? The more I think about it, the more I sense this move is all about generating PSL’s. It really doesn’t make sense from a football standpoint. We need a back who is a pounder like Toby Gerhert who could be had in the 2nd round.
I think Tomlinson will be accepting of a reduced role. He seems to just want to keep playing football and hopefully win a championship. I will definitely be confused if they give him more money than they would have given TJ. I hope if we do sign him, it’ll be for cheap.
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I think alot to do with this is the PSL’s. And yes, LT did say he would accept a reduced role, him visiting the Jets and Vikings make it clear he wants a ring.
I agree that we’re better off with a healthy Leon as the third down back and not LT. That being said, there’s a lot to like about signing LT. There’s just too many “ifs” with the Greene-Washington tandem that makes a veteran like LT mandatory. First of all, Green has never been “the man” before. Will he wear down? Will he get hurt? Will the fumble-itis return? All of this makes it important to have a veteran back behind him. As for Leon Washington, the need to have someone else is painfully obvious. You just don’t know how he’ll be coming back off of the broken leg. The Jets are not sure, which is why they only offered him a second round tender, and even with that low cost of signing him, it’s starting to look like not even a single other team has any interest in signing him. I can see a divisional rival taking a run at him, but they would probably be doing so only in an attempt to make the Jets pay more for him than they want to. You just have to have another back with these two guys.
This brings me to LT vs. TJ. I think the major problem here was TJ’s contract. TJ was unhappy with his contract LAST year, and that was with two years left on the deal. Think of how he would be this year, with only one year left on his deal, and as Shonn Greene’s caddy. Do you think he would still be a clubhouse leader? I think he would be just the opposite. And even if he remained a leader, you don’t think the players will listen to a Hall of Fame running back like LaDanian Tomlinson? He’ll be a leader the second he walks into the locker room, and this is a guy with an impeccable reputation. He’s also going to have a clearly defined role as a backup, so he’s not going to complain about touches and playing time, like a Thomas Jones in the last year of his deal would have. As for the difference in their abilities at this point, I think it’s negligible. Jones probably has more left, but LT was a better player in his prime, so it’s probably pretty even about now. From what I read yesterday, the Jets have looked at extensive film of both and feel that Tomlinson is the better of the two right now, so I’m going with their opinion.
Dumped Edgar Renteria and adopted Buster Posey. Biggest upgrade since George Jefferson moved up to a deluxe apartment on the east side!
All ofthe “ifs” make this signing a worse idea, not a better one. Theres a good chance that he could be called upon to produce in a big way and he’s just shot. The focal point of our offense right now is the running-game, we can’t afford to be forced to rely on a shot RB to carry the load.
HOFer or not he will not be a leader if he’s on the bench. You can’t lead if you’re not playing. And I think Greene would be more inclined to take playing advice from him if Greene wasn’t starting over him.
Jones would be more likely to produce bc he just recently produced last year, while on THIS team. He’s much less of a question mark than LD is who hasn’t produced in the last two seasons.
Missing points, LT is much better receiver than TJ, Leon, and Parker...
and is one of the best backfield recievers in the league, this dimensions alone makes him a better option than TJ or Parker as the backup. He is also a completely different type of runner than either Greene (between tackle) or Leon (scat/ end around) he’s an off tackle runner. TJ was the exact same type of runner as Greene.
BTW Sproles ran for a better YPC because he is an end runner who relies much less on line play than the off tackle or between tackle style.
LD is NOT a better receiver than Leon. Their hands are euqal at best, and a healthy Leon is much more dangerous in space.
TJ and Green are completely different runners. TJ skips at the line and waits for a gaping hole to slip through. Greene hits the hole hard and fast, and if theres no hole he’ll make one. The Colts playoff game exposed the differences in styles and effectivenes. ALl of Jones hops and skips at the line allowed the Colts to swarm him. Greene was much more effective bc he runs much more aggressiveley and with much more authority. LD of today is almost a carbon copy of Jones.
Im no fan of Parker, but he can hit a hole and go a long way, something TJ and LD are a lot less likely to do.
You guys must be joking, LT has had a 100 reception season and has had over 50 8 times, Leons best season was 47...
its not even close, LT may be one of the best receiving back all time, Leons fine, but not in the same league as LT. The only place Leons better is YAC, but he’s a smaller back so of course thats the case.
“The only place Leons better is YAC, but he’s a smaller back so of course thats the case.” And then of course its idiotic to replace Leon with LD.
Comparing stats is ridiculous. LD was a starter, Leon is/was a thrid down back. Of course LD had more receptions, he had more opporttunities. But Leon’s hands are better than LD’s and Leon is better in open space than LD is right now.
You can quote all of LD’s old stats to high heaven, but you’re not getting that player. You’re getting the player thats a year older than the shot player he was last year. LD’s receiving stats are 10x better than Sprole’s. But LD didn’t sniff 3rd downs last year in San Diego. Hmmm. Now why would that be?
That’s exactly the reason I would prefer Leon. Of course I would prefer the LT in his prime, but this LT can’t compare to the speed that Leon has. Of course, that’s assuming he’s 100% by the time we hit the field.
Obviously, you're talking about speed right now
LT ran a 4.38 at his combine… that was faster than Washington. The guy (used) to be really fast. I actually think he’s still pretty fast now, it just takes him longer to reach top speed. He used to be able to do that in one cut. It was freaky. Once LT is on the open, he can still run away from people. He just can’t burst through the line with one twitch like he used to so he’s rarely in the second level anymore.
Correct. I had to say “this LT” because this version isn’t as fast as the one of yester-years. Or, like you said, his acceleration isn’t there anymore and it’s pretty vital. I’m hoping Leon has that still, but it’s really difficult to speculate since he’s still recovering. Maybe LT will be able to reach his top speed better coming off of screens and such.
Obviously the team knew something about Thomas Jones that we don’t. Otherwise, how do you explain this move?
One way or another, Thomas Jones is gone. I don’t want to hear about him anymore, and we need to find a short-term replacement. I would much, much rather bring in an older guy like LT than use up a draft pick on an RB when we have far bigger needs. Maybe Tomlinson wouldn’t have made sense before we dumped Jones, but he does now.
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John im sorry but LT still has gas left in his tank and well be better then TJ could of been. Im not saying this because im mad TJ left he was one of my favorite players but LT is better all the way around as a receiver and running im telling you if we do sign him he well put up decent numbers. Trust me, he well be a great mentor for Shonn and even Leon if he stays I cant stress this enough I want LT to sign I wish he would sign right now.
I 100% agree with this article
I dont see much of a upside of signing LT after letting Jones go. Seems pretty pointless to me. LT is coming off his worst year ever….Jones is coming off another BEAST year, and is clearly better at this point in his career. Whatever. I like Greene and Leon in the backfield…but I really dont get this…
On the money JB!!!!
I wish i could add to it, but u said it all.
Agree with the idea, disagree with some reasons..
I was never, and still am not, thrilled at the idea of signing Tomlinson. As long as Leon is productive next year, we have our perfect future core of RB.
In the article it said that he is not productive anymore, so he couldn’t be productive on the Jets. I disagree, the Jets offensive like can make any RB look good. He would easily be able to increase those ypc number on the Jets.
In conclusion: If Leon gets picked up: Use a draft pick on a RB
If he doesn’t get picked up: Let him get some carries in pre-season and play a few games, if he isnt productive, then you can make a trade.
Dont get Tomlinson involved
As a Charger Fan
I 1000% agree – I posted similar on the Chargers site after this signing. Thomas Jones made hard yards; LT hasn’t done that in 3-4 years. He’s not fast enough to break one (Leon Washington would be much more dangerous as a scat back) and he pretty worthless everywhere else. He even admits to losing his “long speed.” TJ was only going to make like $3 M and LT is $2.5M. Plus TJ’s running style held define the bruiser identity of the Jets; LTs softness helped define the Chargers. As much as he’ll say he’s “classy,” he mops, gets hurt even as he runs out of bounds to "save himself for records, and is delusional about the ability he still has, calling himself the best player in the league last year, better than Adrian Peterson because he blocks better (while missing at least 5 blocks in the last 4 games.) What classy person needs say they are “classy”?
Lottery balls land on DeMarcus Cousins baby.
by bringbackbuddytrees on Mar 25, 2010 12:54 AM EDT reply actions
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