#4 : Your TJ-Workhorse Debate.
by Max Strauss on Feb 27, 2010 8:41 PM EST
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PrintHey everyone, I really appreciate everyone who continues to read my posts, it means a lot to me. Make an account, and comment, and state your side of the debate. I got a massive article coming out tomorrow, I've worked on it since Wednesday.
Is TJ's value appreciated?
To introduce you to the situation, Thomas Jones has articles and he is known in the media world as "The NFL's Indestructible Man". http://online.wsj.com/article/SB10001424052748704130904574644613364152506.html . He has logged 1400+ carries and not had to worry about injuries or ice-baths. He is one of the hardest workers every offseason and he works out everyday. However, he is due a 3.3 million dollar roster bonus, is it worth it? He's proven he can carry the load.
Here are his stats as a New York Jet:
| Season | Rushing | Receiving | Fumble | ||||||||||||
| Att | Yds | Avg | Lng | TD | Rec | Yds | Avg | Lng | TD | FUM | Lost | ||||
| 2009 | 331 | 1,402 | 4.2 | 71T | 14 | 10 | 58 | 5.8 | 28 | 0 | 2 | 0 | |||
| 2008 | 290 | 1,312 | 4.5 | 59T | 13 | 36 | 207 | 5.8 | 19 | 2 | 2 | 1 | |||
| 2007 | 310 | 1,119 | 3.6 | 36 | 1 | 28 | 217 | 7.8 | 25 | 1 | 2 | 0 | |||
(courtesy of http://www.nfl.com/players/thomasjones/profile?id=JON755755)
The issue is that Thomas Jones is almost 32 years old. The saying goes that production drops off after a running back hits age 30. He says he felt like a rookie at the beginning of the season with fresh legs. He showed his production was not going to drop, in fact it was going to improve. After leading the AFC the season before, his impact carried the Jets into the playoffs along with Shonn Greene's emergence.
When Rex Ryan became the Jets head coach, he said, the Jets would be ground and pound team, getting rid of Thomas Jones would be getting rid of the person who made and kept the team's identity in check.
Besides being a hard worker, Thomas Jones is one of the leaders on this team. He is underrated and has the team spirit since the first day he was a Jet. He doesn't care if he posts 10 yards in a game or has to post 200 like he did against the Bills. He wants to win. He has said this. I believe him. If he has that belief, why not keep him for the final year on his contract and not have to worry about another untested rookie running back. There is a lot of depth in this year's draft so that could make your debate argument much stronger.
The fact is he is a team player. When asked about not being voted into the Pro Bowl, he said it's because he doesn't care about personal achievements and he wants what was best for the team. His nonstop work ethic has helped Shonn Greene become a back Jets fans envision as next years starter..
Two other veteran backs have been cut including Brian Westbrook and LaDainian Tomlinson. Is TJ next?
Please send me emails (straussm60@gmail.com) about suggestions for your debates or comment below.
If you are in charge of the Jets today, I have three questions.
1) Do you pay Thomas Jones the 3.3 million he is due after only being paid 900,000 this past season?
2) How do you find someone on the depth chart to replace TJ?
3) If you cut TJ and let Leon re-sign with another team, who else do you bring in depth to the two RB positions?
Well according to the last post by Birch, it looks like he is being released. Is this a good move by the Jets?
Past debates:
#5 : http://www.ganggreennation.com/2010/2/28/1330216/5-your-needs-and-situations-debate
#4 : http://www.ganggreennation.com/2010/2/27/1329167/4-your-tj-workhorse-debate
#3 : http://www.ganggreennation.com/2010/2/26/1328528/3-your-rhodes-situation-debate
#2 : http://www.ganggreennation.com/2010/2/24/1324927/my-trading-up-debate
#1 : http://www.ganggreennation.com/2010/2/23/1323775/my-brandon-marshall-debate
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Good move. Rosenhaus deserves it after holding out. 3rd string runningbacks can be found late in the draft or find someone whos been cut.
Yes. But all running backs get carries. I believe Ryan would prefer a 3 headed monster.
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by Max Strauss on Feb 27, 2010 10:21 PM EST up reply actions
I guess we’ll find out soon enough if TJ is indeed released. I hope the Jets dont go away from the run game. If they let LW walk it woukd have to be to get some free agent, dont know who is out there that complements the Jets at that price level. Maybe Marshal.
Jets green since 1997
I hope they get some good composition.
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by Max Strauss on Feb 27, 2010 10:21 PM EST up reply actions
How did Marshall become Involved?
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by Max Strauss on Feb 28, 2010 11:18 AM EST up reply actions
oh lol.
So….
What’s the future of the running back.
It’s now Greene’s Gang.
What happens?
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Greene is clearly #1 and is expected to pound away
Optimist version: All Hail Shonn! He runs with authority, breaks 1200 yards, stays healthy and does not fumble. Leon is healthy and adds another 600, plus a good amount of receptions out of the backfield and solid special teams play. Their different styles provide balance and misdirection. If anybody is drafted, he is clearly behind these two but is groomed to pick up for Leon in a few years. The pass sets up the run and the run sets up the pass, and opponents are knocked on their (it rhymes).
Pessimist version: Leon has lost a step, Greene misses some games with injury or starts fumbling again. The ghost of TJ haunts the Meadowlands. Rather than passing more because Sanchez grows more as a QB, the team is forced to pass more because running isn’t as reliable. More picks.
The truth is probably somewhere in the middle
I’m more optimistic about Greene than about Leon.
Greene might miss a couple of games, but he will definitely run for 1,000. Leon might have something like a 3.7, or 7 yards per catch – the question is whether he will be fast enough to pick up the first downs when he’s used, or turn long downs to 3rd and reachables.
I would draft a number 3, but I don’t follow the NCAA enough to say who, and as to in which round, well, 3rd or 4th if we can trade somebody to get that pick, and if not, 5th.
Has football gone freaking surrealist?
Or is it just the (sort of justified) paranoia about rapidly aging running backs plus the business mentality?
OK, we know Thomas ran out of gas at the end of the season. Figures with 350 regular season carries plus another 50 in 3 playoff games. Does that mean he ran out of gas forever? I don’t think so. I think in a somewhat reduced role, with 200-250 carries (13 to 16 per game) he would do fine.
He was only coming off the best season in his entire career.
Without him, the Jets would have been 6-10. When Leon was out and Sanchez and Greene were both struggling, he and Cotchery (and Keller to a certain extent) held the team together.
He was worth every penny of that 3.3 million – which could have been saved by cutting Gholston. Cut the 1400 yard, 14 TD rusher, and keep the guy who hasn’t earned himself a spot on the field in 2 years? What’s wrong with this picture?
Greene had fumble issues half the year and got hurt in the playoffs. He showed he could shoulder the full load for individual games, but not the full season. Leon is coming off a nasty injury and could be anywhere from tremendous to toast. Could they replace Thomas’ production by themselves? Maybe, but it’s by no means a sure bet.
As to your questions, Max:
1) Do you pay Thomas Jones the 3.3 million he is due after only being paid 900,000 this past season? I would but the front office has made the opposite decision, it seems.
2) How do you find someone on the depth chart to replace TJ? Some people think Greene is ready to take on the full load with some help from Leon, which translates to “take a backup in the late rounds or a UFA backup”. The latter wastes our FA-spot allowance.
3) If you cut TJ and let Leon re-sign with another team, who else do you bring in depth to the two RB positions? You have to draft somebody.
Thanks for the answers.
I don’t like this move one bit. I feel this was Tannenbaum’s move, not Ryan. Ryan wanted a 1-2-3 punch.
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by Max Strauss on Feb 28, 2010 11:20 AM EST up reply actions
Absolutely
While I don’t want to vilify Tannenbaum, I certainly think that this (and the Feely non-extension) were the GM’s decisions.
...you're a jet all the way.
by OnceYoureAJet on Feb 28, 2010 3:47 PM EST up reply actions
It is a good bet that a 32 year old
running back coming off of a stretch of 3 seasons where he has amassed over 900 carries, and 1500 over the last 5, is a good bet to start declining any time soon. Better a year to soon then a year too late. My heart says I love TJ and he is a warrior, my head says he is a 32 year old coming off 5 consecutive 300 carry seasons(2 of those seasons were actually 290 and 296), who showed signs of slowing down this year, let’s move on.
"Relax, all right? Don't try to strike everybody out. Strikeouts are boring; besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls. It's more democratic."
- CRASH DAVIS
Truth is
Someone is going to get injured this yeat. In a run heavy offense like this, and Shoon’s violent style and Leon’s smaller frame, is inevitable. I thought beinging in TJ to spell Shonn would be fine.
I think you can find a much better option to spell Greene then TJ.
Like a 6th round draft pick or Chauncey Washington. Our O-line is so good it puts a lot less emphasis on who is actually carrying to rock.
"Relax, all right? Don't try to strike everybody out. Strikeouts are boring; besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls. It's more democratic."
- CRASH DAVIS
Chauncey Washington
We haven’t seen anything from him at all, either good or bad.
Now if you’d said Brad Smith, I could agree with you.
Right, because the rest of the rookie class
that hasn’t played in the NFL have showed us lots. Brad Smith is not even a running back, yet you would agree with me if I said Brad Smith should be the 3rd string running back. Interesting.
"Relax, all right? Don't try to strike everybody out. Strikeouts are boring; besides that, they're fascist. Throw some ground balls. It's more democratic."
- CRASH DAVIS
In the sense of getting carries
Regardless of whether he’s handed off to or takes direct snaps and runs the ball
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